City Council HUMILIATES themselves by ignoring FAA drone laws!
All right lets start with. You ryan. Tell us a little bit about why youre here to watch his city council meeting with us, well, im ryan lauderette and i take on uh governments who are trying to put ordinances in place to ban drones. Weve done so a couple of times in michigan. Turning that over to illinois sounds like we may have to do the same in ohio, okay, great and geeksvana sean in the uk. He uh probably knows more about our faa than most of us here in this country, uh. Well, uh yeah. My name is sean im. As as many of you will know, from tnl im from geeksvana im, a journalist here in the uk, as ken says, i do know a lot about drone regulation throughout the world. So im here just to add my opinion to the pot, wonderful and, of course, the ever glowing, the all tan, the two watched, jason shappert from remotepilot101.com and m0a. He is here to uh kind of be the voice of reason. I guess right all: we always always trying to be the voice reason, and i brought sectional charts. I mean who comes to a party without sectional charts, so im ready to go. I mean thats like coming to a kegger without the keg. So lets begin this thing. What youre about to see is how – and this is a great example, what is going on in various places in the country, how a uh municipality in brook park, ohio, just kind of, took it upon themselves to ban drones from their airspace without giving uh any thought To federal regulations, so lets start this and see how this happens.
This is how, when you hear these wacky laws like uh youre not allowed to film in the park after 8 pm and theres, a sign that was made in kinkos, that you have to adhere to and youll be arrested and blip blah blah. How does that happen? This is how it happens: listen an ordinance in acting chapter 527 of the park codified orange entitled flying model aircraft, unmanned aerial vehicles, a huge parentheses uav and declaring emergency introduced by councilman troyer. Okay. What are you laughing for jason, its its the parentheses? You know unmanned aerial vehicles, parentheses uav, you can tell were talking to a real expert here, yeah. He i think he just wants to sound like he knows what hes talking about councilman troyer the floor is yours. Thank you, mr chairman, council uh. This is something ive coveted for a long time. It came across uh in an email. Thank you, madam uh clerk. He did say coveted didnt. He he said he said like this is going to be during his re election campaign. I kept the drones out of the sky. This is for his re election. I think yeah were going to clean up this town, a chicken in every pot and well keep the drones out of the skies – oh, my god and um. I just think weve needed this. For a long time, its simple, it is uh, basically what another city has and its not perfect, because it mentions a water tower, but doesnt okay.
They just want to be like this other city. Well, it sounds like copy paste law like oh, they did this. So this is copy paste, save the taxpayers dollars well just copy and paste their law and add it over here right we want to be cool like uh east jab down there dont mean anything. I have some ideas if youd like to change that, but this just gets us a start to uh to uh regulating drones, and i think that somethings needed especially uh, because people can do good things with them and they can do bad things with them too. So i think we need this regulation and thats it any questions for the good things ken yeah. Thank you. Go ahead, Laughter, im! Sorry! I hope they see this. I hope they see this. They wont, but you you feel like there is a drone pilot somewhere sat at home, watching this going. Oh, this is because of me because he he was definitely hurt by a drone at some point. Oh yeah, one of these guys, one of these guys had like uh you know, was out in the back. You know with uh their their their niece emma sue with the nine piece shes back there. Just the sun bathing looking all good up there in ohio and here comes the drone. Oh, i know its got. A zoom lens run emission run all right. Okay, i digress. Lets continue. President. Has there been any complaints uh to date that were aware of regarding drone usage or anything like that? Um ive had some myself, but no, not that not that thats come about, but the usage is being uh.
Ramped up you see its just been ramped up. Theres been a lot its been wrapped, its been ramped, i saw one, it was ramped, we havent had any any official complaints, but i saw a drone. I didnt like it. So i im sorry. This might be a uk us differential here um here, local councillors, kind of like um work on behalf of their community and um like to take up the causes that a lot of their community feel strongly about. They dont tend to pick ones that theyve had no complaints about, but theyve got a personal problem about thats, a very, very good point and uh. Unfortunately, that happens more often than you think um its because yeah i mean they should take up the issues. I dont see theres a lot of pitchforks in front of the brook park city hall, going down with the drones. Oh well. This is an issue that clearly we need to do something about its just. How many complaints have you had? Well, none so youre telling me zero constituents have come to you to say i have had a problem with drones: thats, poor representation, very poor representation, indeed more and more of them and and its just uh get it before its a problem. As a councilman ive seen two okay yeah, i i im just inquiring, i dont see many many of them. I see people down in the metropolis flying up, but not at least not around my residential area in the city.
I feel ken like were talking about aliens like ive seen you too one went by my house once you know it was two in the morning it was on. My like it just seems like were talking aliens, no ones, seen a drone here, yeah except this one. Guy whos seen two right and its not a problem. Theres been no complaints, yet they got ta, nip it in the bud. Uh ryan. Are you seeing a lot of this preemption stuff happening uh? Unfortunately, yeah thats, it thats exactly the way it happens. They say. Oh wait a minute. We weve got this uh person down the street that is uh flying them over my house at 350 feet or something right. Oh thats got to be invading my privacy in all reality, its probably that somebody in the neighboring town had a legitimate complaint and then theyre like. Oh, that sounds terrible. We dont want that to happen. To us. We better enact some drone rules but um. This is not the way to go about it, um just before i continue this. Maybe someone can speak to how would a town or a municipality like this create a non drone area? They can just create either a a no fly zone. Can they apply through the faa to get that, or is that true yeah they could? They could go to the faa and say: weve got uh specific reasons why no one should be able to fly here and the faa could then say yes or no and answer that question um, but in in this case i think what were seeing is exactly how These things happen is that these city councils go hey.
Somebody else already has this: we dont have to pay a lawyer to look into. This were just going to steal their verbiage and use the same thing. Yeah and the sad thing is that they can do this and then the local police will have to enforce it and then its up to whoever violates to hire a lawyer and go to the expense and the time to fight. Even though the law is on their side, thats yeah indeed – and i i think the other reason why you wouldnt find uh this type of – certainly the way its been set up so far, going to the faa and and and in in in similar form of caa. Here in the uk is because those authorities would actually require evidence. So if you went to them and said um, you know i dont have any complaints. I dont have any evidence ive seen a couple of drones. Then the faa are going to say sorry that isnt enough to just to start putting uh flight restriction zones in place the same as they would here so yeah. All right lets continue with the shenanigans councilman scott yeah through the chair to councilman church um. This is through the total work part correct. Yeah i mean even if they go down like like it was mentioned down by say by uh any fields or anything like that they cant fight. Basically, they cant fly these in in brook park at all correct.
No well. The faa tells you you pretty much. Cant fly them in brook park, but other than that there are sections of brook park. The faa is uh right, its out of that that that radius so um it just just anywhere that you can can fly them. You and people are flying everywhere, um, but no, it doesnt it its a thousand feet and its public places its. As it reads i mean i could read it: okay, dudes. I would love a thousand feet. Please hes pulling stuff out of his ass now and thats. What hes doing now hes like yeah yeah, so okay, i dont, know where they get a thousand feet. What that is even um jason youve got lets lets whip out those sectional charts. Yeah. Can i give some perspective yeah everything before i get to um before i get to that some people i mean sean, brings the the uk contingent and everything international. So, where is brook park in relation to everything just so we can kind of see where were talking about geographically, we are dead smack to the east of cleveland class. Bravo busy busy airspace right, so this is where brook park actually lives just outside of cleveland. If we look at this on the sectional chart, you can see, i mean its right in the surface to 8 000 feet for this class. Bravo, so its right! There i mean the faa is doing a good job regulating that airspace anyways, but heres.
The cool part lets go, look at the vasillium app and see if we get lance approval. So over here is cleveland hopkins again, you can actually see brook part listed here and in brook park the zeros are. Obviously this is like over airport property. I have a 50 footer, a 50 footer on the other side of whatever interstate this is, i think its a 73 ive got 400 footers on the other side of this within brook park. So, despite being in the class bravo airspace because im out of the runway complex, the runways are running this direction. Right, no nothings happening over here, theyre, letting drones pop up to 400 feet just on the other side of the interstate. So again, not the thousand feet that he said wouldnt, we all love a thousand feet, thatd be great, but yeah, but still you could hop in here and you could get lance approval today. If you wanted to, i you know whats funny. I actually did that. A few days ago, and i got approved to fly in in brook park all right so thats, my authorization so um with with with the power of this and with and hed, have to explain sectional charts to these knuckleheads. But if this went to court i mean youd, win itd be expensive, i mean ryan, knows the yeah. What that would take tell us about that ryan heres heres the challenge i dont think youd win at this point really um and the reason being.
Is it doesnt sound like they are regulating airspace, they are using their land use authority to prohibit launch land and operate from so thats, where it really gets complicated like its like in a statement. Is this similar to like how the parks are doing it and such like? I can take off outside of the park fly over the park, but i cant physically use that as my control station thats, exactly whats happening with the national park system is yeah. So when you enter that boundary and youre inside their boundaries, then they are using their land use authority to make that restriction. Now they cant do that outside their boundary. So, if youre standing outside of brook park and want to fly over yeah as soon as theyre coming after you to say, hey you cant fly here, one theyre going to be outside their jurisdiction, literally physically right because youre outside of their boundaries right. But that moment that you step in or even land inside now, theyre looking at using their land use authority to capture you. You know what honestly listening to these people, i dont think they even understand what theyre doing. I dont think they even understand that lets go a little bit further down the rabbit hole as theyve just tiptoed over the line. Theyre gon na go theyre gon na go full bore over into uh illegality. In into here, we go its not we its around certain uh, like our about 130th there at homo, where, where the other trick that the electrical all the electrical stuff somebody cant fly them around there or within a thousand feet of that than a thousand feet of Our pool our outdoor water park that kind of stuff um so its its the standard of limitations on areas we dont want, but other than that, its its the faa that rules rules over that uh huh.
Has there been any discussion with the police department about this? About them forcing it, no, you see if we see an issue with them, trying to enforce it. Whats that do you see an issue with them trying to enforce this, no theres actually uh. If, if it gets, when it gets to be a problem, we can actually theres theres systems out there and i talked to the guy. Well, it was way back at the oai institute uh. It had to be two years ago, maybe four years theres, a guy out there and theres. We can purchase systems if it gets to be a real problem that they can track them. They can, if you see one theres, a setup where you can track where the operator is so if it ever did get to be a problem with that we could. We could do that. Oh, my god, okay hold on theres a lot to unpack there. This guy is such a doofus and we get systems uh ryan. You look like you were biting your tongue. Go ahead! Man! Let it let it spill out, go ahead! Well, yeah! So the systems hes explaining would be uh aeroscope right to be able to look to identify that theres. A drone in the air at some particular place, um yeah that could definitely start tracking you um. At the same token, weve got remote id coming in thats. What i was just gon na say have that ability to track you as well: yes, thats what i was just gon na say: um jason: when is remote id because was it 2023 24, 23, 23, 2023 shes coming.
Okay, so heres my question: how will remote id embolden these kinds wow of uh city councilman, because once they get that, then then everybodys the cops right, its a good insight, i mean again remote id. Is your digital license plate? How many of you see when you pull in a parking garage now they got the license plate scanners, the cars that drive around scan license plates for stolen cars. You know unpaid uh, financing, all that sort of stuff there there they can do that um. Where could they take it for this malicious type of use it? It could be because all the regulation or im sorry, the proposed rulemaking, says right now – is um two local authorities and administers well. They could brook park because they say well thats thats, us right. We want to be able to to be able to type in ken herrons, remote id and oh thats ken here, and he lives here and he drives a mazda. You know and know everything about them. Oh man well see. Well, yes, but also on an enforcement side of things, because the current rid set up is is going to basically have the pilot position available to the public, of course, um. Then, of course, theyre going to be able to have their police officers. Look up where people are flying from and that sort of thing also on on the aeroscope side of things and on that side of things. Local authorities like this should be careful when they are close to airports, just in case theres.
Anybody thats watching because youll often find that the especially these days the airports have already invested in that kind of equipment. So you may actually find that youre doubling up frankly and also interfering with their equipment by launching others within the zones that theyre already covering these things can cover 20 25 mile radiuses these days, um so and most international airports, especially one as busy as that have Them in place – and i dont see a local municipality like brook park, ohio, affording one of these things i mean the most theyre going to spend, is kinko signs that theyre going to put down by wherever the hell they dont want people to fly, but remote id Is going to create an army of cairns right, i mean thats exactly why we were all against it right. Okay, i i dare not continue, but i will there and we could its a lot cheaper if you join that program with other cities, but again its not. This is just legislation, this is a start, you know to regulate them, and and if something comes in i mean the biggest thing, is somebody putting a camera on one and go look into peoples, windows, all right, all right, all right, all right, all right. How many times, how many times have we heard this it had to come up at some point, didnt it we we had to at some point, have the looking through the window thing.
Do you know what, if any, drone pilots out there that are flying to peoples, houses and looking through windows, youre wasted? You need to go, get your 107 and go become a commercial pilot, because with skills like that, if you can actually record what people are doing through their windows, there are so many employers out there right now. Does anybody live in a high rise? I mean a few people do but most people. If you dont, look in somebodys window, you can walk up to the window or yeah use a zoom lens or hell use a phone. You know just youre not going to see this in your window. Im filming your daughter, you know why arent people get and – and another thing, let me just say this: okay, how important do you think you are that we spend two grand on a drone and all we want to do is spy on you and your window. One of the serious issues that i have with this kind of thinking over privacy and looking through peoples windows is is, when you put out the wrong information like this youre, actually allowing those that are using drones for criminality that are using drones to break peoples. Privacy youre allowing them to blend in with everyone else, thats angry about this. What what good effective regulation in any zone, including drones needs to do, is separate legitimate users from nefarious users and that thats what it needs to do to help police to to to zero.
In on the people that want to do some genuine harm with drones, which there are an absolute minority of people out there that do want to do that. This kind of thing puts everyone in the in the same in in the same, gets everyone angry and then the criminals can hide, but and beyond that. Placing a specific regulation to the device is a problem right. So if were going to say you cant commit a murder, then you dont say you cant commit a murder with a gun, because then somebody else can go. Oh im going to use a knife instead, so when you, when you limit it to a specific item such as drones, you cant, pure into somebodys house, with a drone um youve, just limited yourself in terms of what you can do with that law. Now now, rather, you already have criminal mischief or peeping tom laws that are applicable to no matter what device youre using whether its a camera binoculars or a drone keep that existing law use that yeah dont expand into other specific areas. Ive said this before you cannot and although they try, you cannot um regulate common sense, you cant do it and you know what you know. Why theres a picture of a stick figure on a soda machine. You know that picture and hes like no, oh thats, thats. Not for the millions of us with common sense thats for the one dumbass that grabbed the sewing machine and pulled it over on himself thats.
Why that stick figures there for the rest of us that know better anyway. All right, maybe we need um, stick figure. Labels on on drones that are, like you know, a guy like looking in the window with like a big with an accident. I dont all right lets continue this the kind of stuff we got to stop you know and just annoying people with them. Okay, thats. All! I got thanks: okay, any other members, councilman salvatore yeah. Thank you, mr chairman. My question uh will be through the chair to the law director, madame mile director, if the city of brook park ever engaged in the purchase of of a drone for for whatever reason for safety reasons for monitoring a fire from the rooftop there we go and id Always had some you and i have had some dialogue about that, helping finding a missing person an accident, those kind of things. What would would that have an adverse effect on us doing it, but yeah, i dont know if we get a drone. If, if we get a drone, we want to be yes jason. Finally, finally, somebody asking good questions yeah right, its different. If we get a drone, though right, stuff yeah, i just find it so ironic, hes talking about peeping toms stuff and then finally, someone speaks up about what about missing persons. What about our firefighters? What about our law enforcement? Finally, somebody that guys should be should get reelected.
Everybody else can him, maybe i paused it in the wrong spot. Lets continue passing this through the chair to councilman salvatore uh. You might want to look at amending your ordinance. I mean there are certainly many reasons why the city might have a drone. The city might decide it wants to have a drone for building department inspections for the fire department. There are a number of reasons why police department number reasons why we might need one or want one and at that time, if we do acquire one and council has passed this, we may need to look at it carefully and amend it. Okay, thank you. Thank you. Chairman, okay, so well just change the laws to suit us as we see fit right, well, amend them as we go for us and everybody else. Yeah thats yeah thats an interesting one. Theyre talking about the building department right so lets as a city. We can buy a drone and we can fly it over somebodys backyard to see if theyve you know put on a deck without it getting a permit and so were invading their privacy so that we can collect money from them right like like, if you, if you Want to see if you know that hoarder in your neighborhood, if theyve cleaned up their yard yeah also also isnt the whole thing of um. We as the the governance are allowed surveillance, but you, as the people arent allowed to surveil us doesnt.
That start to get technically into the whole thing of a dictatorship: oh man, oh yeah, just technically ever so technically from the you know the definition of yeah. Well, if you say so, youve lived closer to dictators than us. This has just happened in eastern europe, where a a um, a a government, i wont mention which one uh officially said, that there was only, i think it was two or three thousand people at a protest march against that government um a an excellent group who used Drones to expose inaccuracies and lies actually used a drone to count the crowds, and it turned out to be. Four percent of the entire population were actually on the streets to protest against it, and so, of course, the government then yielded um, so its a dangerous road to go down. When you decide who gets to surveil – who i i think a lot of this just stems from these people being woefully misinformed or uninformed, i should say about all of this. You know to to the drone community to to everyone watching this, and especially people that have the part 107 who have gone to boom. Wait. I did you know right up there, one on one.com, youre 718. people whove gone there. Uh were all well informed, but all these, this drone stuff is still new, its still new to most people, believe it or not, um so yeah, i dont know i mean thats a systemic problem where got ta get the word out.
You know im im in these faa uh drone safety, roundtables and um. It does i hate to say this uh on the stream, but i it doesnt seem like theyre getting much done in in way of education. Theres talk about putting labels on drone boxes, but a lot of times they just leave all this warning stuff up to the manufacturers, which is and then and then go a step further ken youre a kid on christmas. You just got your first drone. What do you do right? You rip open the box, you throw the instructions over there figure out how to get the props on right and the first question: how high can it go? How fast can it go? Youre a 16 year old kid right thats all you want to do so. Are kids going to stop and read: read the label right, but theyre, not no theyre, not and thats. Why so many eyes get shot out with the bb guns, all right there you go! Lets read the label. Thank you, councilman cut. Thank you very much, mr chairman um. I too, as a councilman, have actually had an issue with with one incident with a drone and it was used in the wrong way, thats for sure. Unfortunately, for the user they ended up breaking it on somebodys property. While they were spying on them, so karma got them the uh. Okay karma got them. Was it a gopro karma that crashed or was it kelly? Green is right? Yeah i mean you can just you.
Can just tell the whole vibe of them is like nobody is. Nobody has known the joy of flying a drone and that thats what we need. We need to send like uh, go on amazon and and just buy a mini two and send it to them. Heres heres a gift from the drone community, so you can go out and know the joy of flying, but knowing them they would probably just throw it away. Ordinance here does does look pretty good um. I like how in here it does have that it can. It gives uh the mayor or the police chief can give permission okay here we go for things to be utilized. So if we did have an issue, i think with you know, missing person or or if we were using it to help fight a fire or something like that. I think its right in here. So i like this piece. I think it could be very helpful um with it ive read the whole thing over and um, except for the water tower. You know which is fine. Maybe somebody wants to build a water tower in the future, so, but besides that it has the penalty in there and uh. I think at least having a law for, for this is going to be more helpful moving forward because thats only going to be more prevalent. I think moving forward thats. All i have thank you, uh councilman troyer. Thank you, mr chairman yeah yeah.
I got ta offer this, because this is a constant theme in many of these uh. You know. Drone ordinances that comes up is that they want to be able to have an exception in place for whatever personal uses they intend, or even a city use right, and when they put these in its that good intention of well yeah, we might be able to use It for search and rescue whatever and and somebody can give that permission heres the trouble with it. They never follow through with okay heres the process for requesting that permission, heres the forms that need to be filled out, heres the you know we we have to keep this around for so long for the foyer requests et cetera, and we have no. You know uh decision tree as to whats going to be. Yes, you can for this. No, you cant for this or you know. Do you have this to be able to get that? Yes, answer right and thats a real problem: yeah theres, a lot of regulatory dead ends when you start doing things this way and theres proper channels like we were talking about before um as a town reach out to the faa and ask them say this is what We want to do dont just do it. You know what my friend larry, i saw during the other day: okay, no drones, velvet drones and theyre talking about like thousand feet from the water tower or whatever can you imagine if these people were tasked with creating a sectional chart? What that would look like it would look like a whats that whats that that thing, that old toy or spirograph thats what it looks like.
Okay, you have to be over 50. For that one lets continue here: um yeah, i mean uh. The the this was just like, i said this was basically off of another cities. Thats, why water towers in there uh didnt want to go through the hassle of changing it. Didnt want to go, there did copy and paste right jason. They dont even have a water tower, but boy theyve already regulated for it in the future. Laughter just want to. Let leave it. How it was, we could add city owned property, we could own gas stations, so people are, you know they dont go or you know, go, buy a pump cause issue or something because we we could do the metro parks, which you probably dont, want to do. Theyre theyre talking about um piecemealing out the airspace gas stations right. Well, you know those lit those those lithium batteries flying by those fumes. You know yeah thats, ignite and everything great time i just their. Their logic makes no sense here, no sense at all wed do a park. We could do uh ad in that spot bars in the restaurants, their patios, so somebodys trying to run a business. They got everybody on a patio and somebody running them driving around flying a drone in harassing their their people. I mean theres all kinds of reasons why these could get out of control. Okay. Clearly this dudes had a drone watch him on his patio yeah.
Clearly, i was just out there drinking my insurer and drone came along and was filming me and i didnt appreciate it. Oh man, so, and again it does say in there, with with ex with written consent of the mayor of the police chief theres, two areas where it talks about where the mayor or the police chief can give permission to fly it. Okay, okay, this this is where it gets off the rails: crazy, okay, listen, theyre! Talking about people coming in and asking the mayor. I almost want to call right now, which i could do i could cut. When do you get their number and well call? Maybe at the end i dont see where thats a problem: um again: thats thats thats uh thats in thats an inappropriate wrench. So i just think its a good piece of legislation. I think we need it for a while um or we should have had it for a while and its uh, its gon na when needed its gon na, be coming really handy. So, okay thats it all right. Thank you. Um councilman its a good piece to bring uh, definitely bring forward im a little surprised, maybe maybe the state, the county hasnt brought it before or a group of communities. Um, i mean you just stated there same thing: sort of kind of its maybe were lucky something, but he hasnt done something with a drone. Prior to this, we did have little incidents.
None of them were good. Um were by an airport, our homes are clustered together. I would say, i would say: 70 of our homes are clustered together. Somebody could do do do a lot with this with the right drone um one of the things you know that i would suggest that maybe talk to somebody from the safety department, maybe one of the officers whos kind of maybe dealt with a problem like this before And you know some of them do some pretty good research on some things and such, and maybe one of them could uh, maybe lead us in a pretty good way how to go about this a little bit. Maybe it looks like theyre actually reaching out they. They know theyre, not experts, theyre theyre, reaching out for answers, but theyre reaching out to the wrong people. You know its like. Ah, this one officer might know something: oh theyre non experts, yeah yeah go to the f, a a you know what i mean these people boom right. There theres your answer. I think theyre in the phone book, if you guys still use phone books but uh. I i just my face is getting red shawn, you look like youre about to pop uh yeah, its pretty crazy and, and the issue is of course this is actually an international problem, because here in the uk one of the hottest topics at the moment is local Authorities closing their land to hobbyist drone flight in particular, so weve got large cities that the local authorities there are actually saying you cannot take off or land anywhere on on council land, which is um, which is a as i say exactly what theyre discussing here is A hot topic for the uk as well, have you found now? It seems that the faa is copied by countries.
I know that australia, um people will follow suit when the faa does something people follow suit, but are other countries following uh numbnuts like these guys too, like they see, though city council in uh brook park, ohio did this. Maybe we can do that uh in which to shire england or whatever yeah we, we dont, we dont have that issue per se, um its its more actually. We. We have an awful lot happening over here about future flight at the moment and about monetizing the sub 400 uh foot area, and i think a lot of local authorities think the way to monetize. That is, to get rid of all the hobbyists. So then we can bring in the flying, taxis and everything else, not realizing that those things are, you know 20, 30, 40 years away. Basically yeah ill be long dead by the time people are flying around in uh e hangs uh, probably because any thats it. I was just sitting on my patio, and here comes this e. Hang jason your thoughts. I like how you left me in the middle of a joke, my thoughts on e. Hang. Let me tell you, though listen they they dont own, this airspace. They do own their land and i i can understand the point that ryan was making earlier, but municipalities need to realize you dont own, that airspace the moment you leave that ground its, not yours anymore, to to regulate and have the authority to do such but to Ryans point: the land is yours yeah, so you see.
Weve also got an issue here which takes this whole debate. Another step further weve just had a barrister, theres a theres, a theres, a barrister that runs a youtube channel here in the uk, uh, so obviously relatively well qualified in the in in the legal sense, and the whole argument now is coming up with how can a Local authority that is obviously there to serve those local people banned them from doing something which is. There is no evidence that there is any kind of issue with. Basically, so you then start to get to think of. Actually, can you enforce, especially here in the uk, is again a really hot topic? Can you actually enforce a local ban from a local authority on council land when, of course, its the people living locally using that that have the right to use that public land? It seems like thats the crux of the argument and maybe ryan. You can speak to that a little bit because youre actually going through some uh real life, practical tests of these kind of things yeah exactly, and so you know right now. We are suing ottawa county ottawa. County has decided that you cant fly within a 500 foot radius of their council offices, uh their jail, the county courthouse. So imagine this that you have a house thats right across the street and you want to have a picture for your mls listing um, you know grabbing a drone and doing so is not going to be legal under that ordinance, and so we are, we are having To push back and fight against that, not the same token, you know we are at a point now, where we dont have legal beyond visual line of sight without a waiver, but were getting close.
We are getting very yes and when that takes place, who cares? Where youre standing – i can be, you know, 10 miles out and im over that property, where you think you have land use authority and it doesnt matter, because the jurisdiction is air space. Is there going to be one landmark case that sets precedent, or is it going to be just little people just chipping away here and there uh, adding to the whole thing? How how is it gon na play out and and once remote id gets here? Will that cause things to settle down or will it stir things back up again? I think its probably gon na start things back up again, but i do yeah absolutely its going to stir things back up and and just you know that first question is: is it going to be one landmark case or is it going to be multiples, and i Can tell you right now its going to be multiples, so, even where we won with uh mco mcdo versus genesee county, we were able to make sure that genesee county could not regulate drones. But then ottawa county stood up said well that doesnt apply to us, because we arent genesee county right so now were having to chase them and it you know well get it to a court of appeals and once we get it there, then we have precedent for The state but thats right state. Now we got to turn it around to every other state in the nation right, so you can set president precedent for your state, but we need to set some national pressure.
It needs to go federal, yeah yeah, to get the federal caseload there. You know, ryan. I have a question for you back to uh many minutes ago, when we were talking about like the national parks i can take off outside the national park fly over. It come back land and i understand that its their land uh their their land, use rights or land use authority im. Sorry. How would that if i live in brook park in these clustered homes, because i apparently live in clustered homes yeah? If i live in one of these clustered homes in brook park, i pay my taxes on my property. Can i fly launch from my own backyard and yeah and thats thats? The big key here is theyre, saying no, you cant, and they would actually have that authority to do so and thats a real challenge, because what theyre doing is the same thing as saying you need to apply for a building permit to put a deck on your House, its the exact same land use authority that would take place over you launching from your own property, and you imagine that and and think that, how is that possible and yet thats exactly how land use authority is written? Now the the same thing is, you know, ottawa county if youre limited to 500 feet around the uh, the courthouse per se and you go 700 feet away and launch hey no problem. I could go and be right next to your uh window.
If you wanted to on the courthouse and thats, not an issue until you get to those other laws that we talked about, the you know, the peeping tom laws, et cetera, use those to get rid of the bad behavior right. Dont put in these arbitrary things that really arent restricting anything at all right, especially when we get to beyond line of sight. Yeah i mean this this. Let me ask you sean. Do you have hoas in uh the uk? We do yes, yeah. We we do have housing associations and again we have a similar thing here and i think its a there is a perception that that people have that when you buy a property, you know you thats it its yours. You could start mining for gold if you want to that type of thing, but but actually modern property transactions do include clauses that say you have to adhere to the local ordinance. You have to adhere to the local land laws and planning laws, etc, and so, if that is changed centrally, it sweeps across the board but yeah we do have housing associations. Here i cant imagine living one of those places. You know: hey man im an artist. This is my pinto that i mow around thats art thats, a sculpture. What are you talking about but, like you know, we we actually have housing association rules here in the uk, which are things like you, cant park, vans, uh, so truck so commercial trucks or even like a ford transit type im trying to do the uk us explanation.
There um, i i once lived on a street where the the tarmac area to the main road was was red, tarmac and you werent allowed to park on the red youre only allowed to park on the black bits. Basically, so i i actually used to have neighbors come and knock on my door, because i would pull up very quickly to run in and grab some bits and pieces and pack a bag or whatever so be out. There 15 minutes outside the house that i have ive paid a lot of money for, but because im parked on the red bit theyre knocking on my door, asking me to move my car here, heres the problem, its all these little authorities and groups of authorities, whether It be a town, a municipality, an hoa, a security guard whos in charge of the airspace trip power, trips, yeah yeah hes in the security guards in charge of his parking lot down at the brewery or whatever, and he says you cant fly here. Well, you can say that all day long – and it may be true, but i can go off your property and fly in thats. You know again, i was flying in nashville. The the the capitol building is on state park. Property right across the street is not state park property and i explained to a guy with a badge there um that i can take off from there and fly in and he actually knew – and this is about three years ago – he actually knew well yeah.
You can. Oh you got me like i wasnt going to tell you that, but i i just happen to know and again thats. Why thats important? Because you can power yourself, empower yourself with the knowledge that you get from remotepilot101.com and m0a right, jason, thats right, sir! Thank you for that. I appreciate you, you bet ill, send you an invoice. All right lets continue with this theres, something we didnt see, maybe theres something they see or potential problems down the road. So but but overall, i think its a pretty good piece and um yeah youre right, probably could use a little work but to bring it forward. Now very good, so council councilman troyer, thank you, mr chairman um. I mean i dont theres, no big rush to get this done. Uh wonder mayor, wonder if you could have the police chief come up to a meeting and speak of it police caucus. I think that would be best yeah, the next, the next yeah, the next round of such caucus. Sure the pre pre council caucus, yes, okay, uh, so uh caucus from next caucus next regular, i dont know but uh id hate to see the minutes from this meeting. But uh theyre, just so flippant and just so matter of fact about well things yeah one one thing that disturbs me a little bit on this is that you know in our in our drone community weve got a lot of people like ryan, like ken, like jason, Who know their stuff and who, who really do the research? How is it possible that a a group of uh counselors, a group of leaders of of any size of population, can do such little research that the guy in the uk knows more about the rules that theyre talking about than they do? Theyve got all this documentation in front of them; they could literally they could.
They could misspell drone experts and jason shepard would pop up on their computer and they can dial, hey, hey, m0a, wed, love you to come and consult and tell us, you know, you guys are the experts, so this is another way of saving on on lawyers fees And everything else like that call jason, have jason, come in and talk to you about what you can and cant do. You know con and i have a professional consultant yeah. It doesnt seem like they want that. It seems like they just dont want drones, but they dont want to go to the trouble of researching anything yeah its its like its like. If youre a kid – and you want a cookie, you just take the cookie and apologize later right. Mom cant take the cookie. It does remind you, you got it right, its its like um whats, that saying id rather ask forgiveness than permission right. So you know they know. I mean governmental entities like the faa are so overstretched that uh something like this. They could enact this legislation and these rules and they could be in effect for a good long time before anybody challenges them but uh. This video is almost over theyre about to take a vote so lets schedule caucus promotions so made by councilman troyer uh seconded by councilman salvatore any discussion so before you call the role. What would the date on that caucus be november, 9th november 9th okay go ahead! Well call please troyer, yes, salvatore, yes, mancini! Yes, yes, schmuck! Yes, lets get! Yes! Okay! Thank you! Well see ordinance.
527. Um last we have a resolution. Honoring cheryl chorneck for being chosen; 2012. Okay, all right! So all right, all right! Well, the the uh, the yays, have it drones suck we dont want them in our town, throwing them out of town wow. I dont know this just you know what its fascinating ken that the previous clip he was talking about. You know theres really no rush on this, but theyre theyre sneaking over bars and theyre. Looking in my windows, but theres, no rush, no rush right, the the urgency initially its like oh its, like uh, theres, roving gangs of drones around what do you say: theyre, revving up or theyre rallying up or something but theres, no rush, yeah its honestly. It honestly sounds to his to his defense to the chaps defense hes been putting this forward. It honestly sounds like hes had a counter drone services company bend his ear at a conference a few years ago, and that has that has scarred him. Hes then seen a drone within i dont know. The drone was probably taking real estate photos of his neighbors property and he then thought, oh, my god, that drone that that drone is looking at sarah. Is it you call it uh developed anyway. So it sounds like hes had misinformation, hes had bad information, but again you could fall over the keyboard and still come up with experts in in in in us airspace and an faa et cetera.
You dont even have to go to the faa themselves, even though, of course, they would im sure they would welcome um local local law officials coming and talking to them its ridiculous. It really is, and it kind of its kind of them shooting themselves in the foot, because ive never been to brook park. Ohio, oh im, gon na go im gon na go but im thinking on the 19th for the caucus we go ken yeah. Oh, you know what a big caucus fan i am but uh. You know it seems like theyre shooting themselves in the in the foot, because, if its a beautiful place, maybe people go there for the leaves changing or for whatever, like the the biggest slice of cheese or whatever the hell they do up there. You know theyre gon na have people tourists up there with cameras flying cameras and theyre gon na be very disappointed that could affect their economy but uh. This video has gone on quite a bit, so lets wrap things up now by going down. Lets start with you, ryan, as the train, you can hear my train coming in im gon na have to edit around the damn train ryan lets start with you about uh, realistic things that we, as the drone community, can do to uh help foster change yeah. So well one. My final thoughts on this would be um, especially with the ordinance that theyre looking at theyre looking at banning within a thousand feet of things like cell towers and electrical substations.
This is you know, bread and butter. For many part 107 pilots who do inspections so if youre a part, 107 pilot who participates in those kinds of things, i you know get on the horn, get an email, uh generated to the city council and say: hey heres. Why you cant put this in place? This is an effect on my personal uh income, and this is an effect on the businesses that do uh provide those types of services um. Otherwise, might it be uh something a little bit kinder and gentler uh to go approach, your local town or council or whatever and say look? I know a little bit about this stuff. If you have any questions, just ask me im in the business. I do this for a living to anybody who does or a hobbyist that just happens to know a little bit more to offer themselves as a point of information that some council people and municipalities so are desperately uh lacking right, absolutely thats, exactly one of the first Things i did back in what 2012 2013 is. I went to the city council and said: hey. If youve got any questions about these things, let me know, and they looked at that thing going we dont even know what that is. So yeah were going to definitely come to you yeah yeah, be an ambassador. I say be an ambassador yeah sean, your your your final thoughts yeah. I i would actually hark back to one of the the cases that uh ryan was actually involved in previously jason harrison.
He he went from the individual in cuffs for flying his apartment pilot for flying. His pu is his drone legally in a park to actually becoming an ambassador, and actually he he now does talk to that – that to to that local uh municipality, about drone use and about how to do things effectively. So he is a prime example of exactly how you should do it. Dont become an in my opinion, personal opinion dont become an extremist. This isnt about. Oh, these people are trying to tear our hobby down. Lets be moderates in the middle lets, bring them to the middle lets, not try and drag them across a line that theyre never going to get across. Lets do like jason did in in michigan and bring them into the center and realize all the good that drones can do and all of the fantastic futures thats. There also talk about economy which, which ryan did touch on stress to these people, just how much money local authorities can make out of drones in the next 15 20 years. Yes, yes, i mean its just like any technology that comes along people are going to be scared of im sure when the toaster was invented. Theres some people going. You know what i like them: fancy toasty, you put the thing in, i dont get it you plug it. In i dont know i like holding my bread over the fire like a normal person. Im not gon na go anywhere, get those toasters.
I dont know why. Im playing the hillbilly music, but you know what im saying but uh uh jason uh your final thoughts on this whole thing. Well, i just want all the viewers to know that before we started recording ken huddles all together and said: hey guys, this will be a quick, 10 minute video. I hope you all enjoyed this 35 minute video, because i dont know how youre going to edit this down to 10 minutes again. I just dont know how its possible, i might just upload it, as is its all gold, its all gold, but anyways um. You know on a serious note, though ken you have such a great reach. I know for a fact this video is going to go on to get thousands of views. I kind of want to take my my closing remarks and put it back on ryan and say ryan. What can all of us on this call? Do? What can all the viewers do? I mean, like you said, lets like sean said: lets stay in the center lets. Not send extremist mail to all these people, but what is the right thing to do to maybe educate and take this leverage that kens provided all of us to help? Fellow part, 107 pilots and hobbyists in the brook park, zip code yeah get the word out to everybody exactly yeah, so you know and if im doing it one im im definitely going to be sending them an email to say: hey, you know, contact me, youre welcome! Heres, my personal cell lets talk through what you can and cant do, but one of the big things im going to do is im going to say here is a list of your fizdos.
You know call these people. These are the folks that you can consult with that. Give you the airspace theyre going to walk you through the technical. You know, charts to say this is where drones can operate. This is where they cant operate, without special permissions and and kind of ease their fears. As to you know what the airspace entails in terms of whether theres other aircraft in the area, i think the other challenge is going to be is trying to get them in touch with the state police departments right its, not just their local police. Looking at um, you know, hey weve got potential emma sue being spotted it, but we have the the idea that hey these, these mischief uh mischievous actions of spying on somebody already have laws in place and they can be utilized heres how your police department would utilize Them without having to go the extremes of creating a new ordinance right, i think just basic things are are lost on them like i bet, none of them actually realize that uh drones are considered aircraft by the faa, just like any other aircraft.