How was the kfc very good huh, okay and uh? Did you have enough? Okay lets proceed. Uh, mr gross grace im gon na approach you for a second, if i can that i had um showed you that you have given the police on the 26th. Is that right? Yes, so on this document, its mark 25 20. I dont know if thats reference to the time of the incident, but this statement was given uh. It looks like uh. Oh 900, im. Sorry, 9 46 a.m of the following day. So just so were clear. It says on this on 8. 25. 20 at 11; 30 p.m. This happened right, correct, okay, so the only thing i want to make sure that youre comfortable, saying is theres um markings at various points on this paper is that right? Yes, there is okay, and the statement is two pages. Would you agree with that? Yes, i would okay, and can you tell me what those marks are on the left hand, side of that document um what is being referred to? Um there are circles, it looks like two on the first page, two on the second page, and these are uh. On the left hand, uh indent and in those circles are my initials okay, so you had at various points during that statement. Initialed put your initials on it: correct uh i wasnt able to im right hand dominant, so i wasnt able to write so the officer that uh im not sure which officer that was, but the officer was taking my verbal statement, transcribing it and then throughout.

I would initial either so you can see here, theres uh. The word approximately was crossed off. I signed that theres, a correction there made okay. So can i ask you this where it says i told multiple officers that i had dropped my firearm right next. To that you put your initials. Is that right? Yes, i did okay and to be fair on the bottom of each one of these pages. It says i have made the above state made the above statement without any threats or promises. It is my desire to state the true facts as to this incident. I have read the above statement and find it true and correct. Is that what it says? That is what it says: yes, okay and you initially signed that correct, correct, okay, so my last uh, where we left off, i just have a couple questions for you. I had asked you if you had any regrets about that evening and that you had said that you did not correct correct. I had to ask you if you know a person uh jacob marshall, correct, yes and jacob marshall may not be today, but he was your roommate yes, and you had said that he had visited you um in the hospital, yes and im going to show you what Is marked, as exhibit 70. im, not interested in the stuff on the right right now, im just interested in the photograph. Okay. Is that a photograph of you and mr marshall? Yes, it is okay.

Does that appear to be taken uh after you had suffered the injury to your arm, yes, okay and thats at a hospital? Is that fair? Yes? Okay, so you said you didnt have any regrets? Did you tell, mr marshall, that your only regret was not killing the kid and hesitating to pull the gun before emptying the entire mag into him? No, i never said that you didnt tell that to your roommate objection. Asked nancy. You didnt tell that to mr marshall. No, i did not very good. Thank you, sir. Did you remove 69 and 70. any attention uh? We can do it after. If you want your honor, can we talk about those two exhibits afterwards? I do have objection to both of them. Yep. Okay! Thank you. Okay, mr gross grace, i just have a few uh, follow up questions here, um at one point in the video that was played for you by the defense. You referred to the defendant as a boogaloo boy. What did you mean by that? I dont recall if i was referring specifically to the defendant. I think a more accurate statement would be the group of armed individuals, predominantly white males with ar 15s and, generally speaking, some sort of well say para, military attire, and what i mean by that is camel clothes body, armor chest rigs, helmets things things of that nature Is it fair to say, mr grosskroitz, that no matter what you tell us or remember everything you did that nights on video or photographed correct? That is true.

I want to play a little bit of exhibit um 57. Can we go to the 31 minute mark? Please 31 minute this was a portion of the exhibit that was played for you on cross examination, and i just want to go back to that. For a moment. Can we play from there? Please looks like the boogaloo boys, the little boys rolling up two right there. Two right there youre good, you can go home the voice, thats heard there saying we got our own medics. You can go home thats your voice right. Yes, it is. Why did you say that it was my interpretation throughout the events of august 25th that these armed individuals, whether they were boogaloo boys, proud boys, et cetera, um, all had a lets, say a homogenous appearance again, meaning the rifles, the body armor, and what i had inferred Throughout the events of that night that these groups of people werent received very friendly towards um other demonstrators um and in specifically to reference the defendant. It was also my interpretation that the defendant lacked the the necessary experience, potentially the necessary knowledge to adequately fulfill. His self proclaimed role as a medic. Can we now go to the 57 minute and 36 second mark in this video, please um thats, why you got problems already with people? I know a question about the defendants reaction at that very moment in time when he was told by someone dont go out in the street, stay on your property and you were asked if he, if the defendant reacted in any certain way.

Do you know if he came and spoke with anyone about that comment at that moment in time? No, i do not. Okay now can we go to the um one hour, 17 minute and 10 second mark in this exhibit please Music that sounded like gunshots. It sounds like multiple gunshots people are scattering now this is southbound on sheridan. This is, i was just at 60th, looks like they even set up a recliner. Do you hear what the crowd is saying at that point i do and what were they saying? Uh sounds like theyre yelling medic is that is that what caused you to start running? Yes, it is okay, go ahead, Laughter, hey! What are you doing you shot? Somebody? Is it fair to say, mr gross courts that what was just played on the screen is the only words exchanged between you and the defendant after the defendant killed joseph rosenbaum, yes and youve already explained what you heard at that time. Weve already heard the video was there ever a time in which the defendant said, someone pulled a gun on him. In hindsight, no in your statement the next morning you told the police youd heard the words something effective. He pulled a gun on me from the defendant. Is that right, correct, with the benefit of hindsight, we can see that never happened, correct correct at the time you gave the statement to the police the following morning. How long have you been awake a couple hours, no more after surgery after surgery, yes and before surgery? Youd been awake all day, tuesday, right, yes, and in the in the time period between you were shot by the defendant and the time you spoke to the police officers.

Did you even have possession of your phone? No, i did not had you watched this. Facebook live stream. No, i had not. Can we continue that uh video? Now, please stop him Applause! Oh up Laughter! We can still hear audio but theres no video coming from your live stream. Do you know why that is at this particular moment in time? I believe its because i dropped my phone after being shot by the defendant, to the best of your knowledge did the audio that we just capture or watch rather did that capture everything that you said when you are, after you talked to the defendant, had that little Exchange until you got shot yes at any point in there did you say anything about youre going to kill the defendant youre going to shoot the defendant, make any threats to the defendant of any kind? No, can we please pull up, exhibit number five uh um while were getting ready for exhibit five um. Let me just ask: may i approach on him right, mr grosskroyds, the defense has shown you a photograph which has been marked, as exhibit number 65. im just going to hold that, for you. Does this show you with your hands raised before the defendant. Shoots you! Yes, okay and ill, just i think this has been on the tv screen, but ill just show the jury. Are you pointing your gun at the defendant here? No im not is this right before he does the re racking of the gun? Yes, it is and then exhibit number 66.

This is the photograph that shows you uh moving towards the defendant after he re wrecks the gun. Is that fair to say? Yes, it is now you were asked if you are pointing your gun at the defendant. In this picture, and also in exhibit number 67., do you remember being asked those questions? I do at any point during that encounter, did you intentionally point your firearm at the defendant? No, i did not. Can we play exhibit five, please at this point in the video there are people that are running in the same direction as the defendant. Are you even on screen, yet i dont see myself on screen. Now all right lets keep going. The person that attempts to kick the defendant has flown over the defendant. Mr huber is approaching the defendant. Are you even on screen? Yet no im, not all right lets, continue now at this moment in time you are in on the screen, and it appears that youre sort of crouching you know like crouching down as if what what were you thinking at that moment? Why were you doing that? Um? First, yes, that is me on the screen crouching and it was a reactionary, um. Uh instinct, i guess, is a good way to put it and the best way that i could describe. That is one the the noise from the shot. I mean its a very large caliber firearm and i think that in itself probably startled me, but then my immediate next thought was i could be shot next.

If your intent was to shoot the defendant with your glock pistol, would you have gotten that close to him? That was my intent. No, if that was your intent, you wouldnt have done that exactly right, correct lets keep going for just a second, please would you mind if you can standing up and demonstrating to the jury, how your body is positioned in this still, so, if well, give you the Microphone and if you could just step in front of the jury there id like you to demonstrate this for us, if you could might have to hold it really close uh. So in this still, if the defendant is right here in front of me on the ground, this is my pistol that i had my hand. My cell phone, my body, is bladed towards the defendant on her cell phone, in my left hand, microphone or pistol in my right. My body is bladed, with my left hand, left arm towards the defendants firearm within my pistol in a similar angle. Im about to show you when you were putting after all this was said and done, was there any um impact or anything like that on your left arm from that gun shot? Yes, there was: what was that uh? It was determined to be a muzzle burn from its proximity to the defendants gun so a little more context on that on a bullet just fire, their gases that are expensive, thats, fine, you can go ahead and have a seat.

Thank you for doing that. At that moment in time, right before you got shot by the defendant, did you feel there was an imminent danger that the defendant was going to kill you? Yes, absolutely when you were just demonstrating to us the way your right hand was holding the gun. However, it was angled. My question for you is: is that the way you hold and point a gun when youre going to shoot it down? I have no further questions. So, mr grosskind, you um watched the video of that mr binger played when mr rittenhouse was walking past. You and you had said something along the lines of no medics are needed here. We dont need you right. Yes, okay and you were um saying that. Oh here comes some boogaloo boys youve never met mr rickhouse. Before have you no im? Not you had no idea who he was any affiliation with any group, nothing right. No! You were just spouting off guessing. Yes, i was making an inference. Yes, no information, yes and mr um finger asked you have you ever threatened verbally with words, mr rittenhouse, do you remember him asking you that i do and your answer was he did not yes, youd agree. People dont have to use words to threaten other people. They can do it by their actions. Correct, yes, like running after them down the street with a loaded firearm right, yes, like approaching them loading their foot and moving their gun forward, while the persons on their butt sitting there right.

Those are non verbal things that can be used to show aggression correct. Yes, now you had been asked um by mr binger, and you had shown a demonstration of um this blading maneuver as you call it and ill take you your word on that. Can you bring up 67 so now you can talk about what your mental intention was. Youd agree. What everybodys looking at is you pointing a gun in a persons head right as well as a defendant, pointing his firearm at me? Absolutely, but you are by your own admission, pointing a pistol from less than three feet away at his head agreed. I dont agree with that. You dont agree that that gun is pointed in the direction of mr red house. You dont agree with that in the direction. Yes, but directly now you didnt tell them what you were doing right. I dont have time to well as youre running you didnt say anything right, youre, just chasing him down. You never say anything. It would have been hard to communicate that over gunfire. My question to you is, you never said a word to him other than approach him with your gun out from three feet away right? Yes, i have nothing else. When you asked the defendant, if hed shot anyone, he lied to you didnt he, yes, you did and even though youve been asked questions about what he said at various times or things like that, did he make threats to anything like that to people anything like that.

You construed his actions as threatening didnt you based off of witnessing the first two shots with jump, kick man the second sorry, the third shot to kill anthony huber. Yes, thank you Music. He didnt lie to you right when you had contact with him. He didnt lie to you. Did he? Yes, he did have. He lied to you after having asked him who was shot, who was shot and then him saying im going to the police, which we know after the fact and then saying i didnt do anything so its your testimony today that you heard now to be fair. Your first interview that you signed, you said that he told you im working with the police right. This is beyonce right. That is what i thought i heard in the moment. Yes, okay, so you werent telling the correct statement: correct uh. Can you yeah? You said that you said that mr rittenhouse lied to you. Yes, your initial statement to the police was, he told me he im working with the police. You know thats, not true after the fact. Yes, okay, so what is on tape? Is he said, im going to the police right? Yes, youre, not saying thats, not true, no im, not nothing else. You missed a counselor. Okay, still call heather williams to the stand. Stan, please finish right hand to satisfy the testimony about to give this man to be the truth, the whole truth and death for the true self Music.

Please say your name and spell it for the benefit of the court. Reporter first name is heather h e, a t h, e r last name is williams w. I l l, i a m s: hey were you employed the wisconsin state crime laboratory located in milwaukee? And what is your current position at the crime laboratory in milwaukee? I am a firearms and toolmark examiner and how long have you been employed with the wisconsin state crime lab as a firearms tool mark examiner a little over five and a half years, and what does that mean to be a firearms or tool mark examiner as a Firearms and tool mark examiner, i conduct examinations of firearms and firearms related evidence such as fired cartridge cases and fired bullets, and is there any specialized education or training that you have done pertaining to your job as a firearms or tool mark examiner? Yes, i first hold a bachelors of science degree in law enforcement and justice administration with a minor in forensic science that included a 525 hour internship at the dupage county forensic science center. I also completed the wisconsin state crime, laboratory, firearms and tool mark examiner training program. Its an apprentice type training program, much like an electrician or a plumber where you get both hands on and classroom like instruction and what exactly is firearms identification? Firearms identification is the comparison. Analysis of fired evidence compares bullets to barrels and cartridge cases to firearms and what process is used when examining a firearm that is submitted to your section? One of the first tasks that we perform when a firearm is submitted to the firearm section is called a function test.

The purpose of the function test is to first make sure that the firearm is a functional firearm and that is also safe to test fire. During that function, test ill check the condition of the firearm, along with all safeties that are associated with that firearm. And then what do you do? Next with when examining that firearm, once ive determined that that firearm is safe to test fire, i will test fire. The firearm: this is done to make sure that the firearm is working properly and the way that the manufacturer intended for it to work and also instances in which we have fired evidence. Those test, fired bullets and cartridge cases that are produced are then compared to that fired evidence to see if they were or were not fired in the submitted firearm. And did you become involved in a case in your professional capacity regarding uh kyle, rittenhouse, joseph rosenbaum and anthony huber? Yes, i was, and how did you become involved? With that case, i was assigned to work that laboratory case id. Show you what is previously marked and admitted, as states exhibit 28.. Do you recognize that? Yes, i do. I recognize that as the firearm, that i analyzed for this specific case, how i recognize that is on the firearm in silver marker. I have indicated that laboratory case number associated with the case. The item designation of that item, my initials and the date that that was examined. So is it my understanding that you would have actually examined this exact firearm and fired it correct? Yes, okay uh.

I think thats good, thank you. So what do you use to test fire it with were going to use ammunition? That is part of our reference collection. When we choose the ammunition for our test fires, we try to choose it as close to the fired evidence. Thats submitted to that case, what is a cartridge? A cartridge is unfired ammunition, thats going to consist of four components: youll have the actual cartridge case, youll have the primer, youll have the propellant or gunpowder, and then you have the projectile or bullet. So what is a cartridge case? A cartridge case is a portion of a fire cartridge that is left over after its been fired in a firearm. You may have commonly heard it referred to as brass, and how do you determine if cartridge cases were fired in the same firearm, youre going to look at markings that are transferred onto the fired cartridge cases during the firing process? Those are the markings that we look at to determine if they were or were not fired in the same firearm and then instances when we have a firearm were able to determine if they were or were not fired in a specific firearm. So whats the difference between a cartridge and a bullet. A cartridge, like i said, is going to be the full unfired ammunition. So its going to be those four components. A bullet is just one of those four components, so its the projectile portion that youll see on an unfired cartridge.

So what is a fired bullet? A fired bullet is going to be. The bullet that is expelled through the barrel of a firearm is going to have impressions that are going to be left on that from the rifling or that spiral pattern thats going to be within that bore of the barrel. So how can you determine if fire, if bullets were fired in the same firearm, youre going to look at those rifling impressions that are left on a fire bullet from the barrel that its been fired through uh? Is your crime lab accredited? Yes, we are and who accredits your uh, your crime lab. We are accredited through a nab, a n, a b. It stands for the american national association standards, national accreditation board and are there any quality, controls or procedures that are used, particularly in your discipline at your crime lab? Yes, in the firearms section, we have a three step: quality control procedure. The first step is called the verification process. This is when any type of identification, elimination or inconclusive results of fired evidence is then looked at by a second qualified examiner in the section once that verification process has been completed. There is, then, a peer review process in which all notes and reports that looked at to make sure everythings, clear, complete and accurate that last step is going to be administrative review. That is going to be when a supervisor will once again go through all reports and notes, make sure everything is clear, complete and accurate.

Before the report is submitted to the submitting agency is marked, as states exhibit 72. Do you recognize that i do this? Is the report that i issued for this specific case? I know that, based upon the laboratory case number as well, it has my name as well as my signature, and then it also has information on the second page, with my initials, showing that i did complete both of these pages of the report is that a true, Accurate copy of the report that you issued in this case – yes, it is, i reckon visit 72 in the evidence. I dont even think you see lets here. Isnt marked as states exhibit 71. Can you please explain what this is? This is one of the fire cartridge cases that i analyzed for this specific case. I can tell that, based upon the laboratory sticker, the yellow sticker here. This has the laboratory case number associated with this case. The item designation, as well as my initials and date that i took this into my custody. I also have the information on the additional packaging for this specific item, and then we also have that information on the actual cartridge case itself so which, which was the bullet that was fired, allegedly by the defendant. Where would that be in that packet? This is just going to contain one of the fired cartridge cases, so this is a portion of a cartridge that was fired, so this is the portion that is ejected from the firearm so that the thing in the the top of the that threefold – that is what Was presented to you is an already fired cartridge thats, not one that you fired correct.

Yes, this is a piece of submitted evidence for this specific case. So what kind of uh is that a true and accurate copy of how you would have packaged up that particular cartridge, uh casing and all the other elements in exhibit 71? Yes, i know that this is how i package this piece of evidence, because at each one of the um heat sealed seals its going to have my initials as well as the date that i actually sealed this piece of evidence id like to exhibit 71 in evidence. So after you test fire, the weapo, the uh, the gun that we saw, then what happens next in your analysis. So what i will do, then, is: i will compare those test fired, cartridge cases to the fired evidence, cartridge cases for this specific case. I do that by using what is called a comparison microscope. This are two microscopes that are then connected by an optical bridge. It allows myself as an examiner to look at two objects simultaneously side by side that way im able to see the markings that are transferred from the firearm during that firing process. On the cartridge cases to look to see if the submitted evidence was or was not fired in the submitted firearm, so what did you do in this particular case? In this particular case, there are eight fired cartridge cases that were submitted each one of those eight fired cartridge cases were then compared to the test fire cartridge cases that i produced so that i could be able to determine if they were or were not fired in This emitted firearm, so you were submitted eight of the.

If you hold up exhibit 71 briefly, you were, you were given eight of those cartridges on top. Yes, as eight fired cartridge cases just like this. One here was submitted for this specific case and analyzed, and did you find that um all eight of those cartridges were fired through the weapon that detective entering showed you? Yes, i was able to determine that the eight fired cartridge cases submitted in this case was fired in the submitted firearm, and that was by comparing each one to the test fired projectiles that you fired correct. Yes, i have nothing further. Thank you well, thank you. You may step down man officer jason krieger to the sand, sir. I do seated sir. Can you please state and uh spell your first and last name for the record: jason krieger, thats, uh, j, a s o n k, r? U e g e r and how are you employed with the city of kenosha police department? How long have you been on the city of kenosha police department, approximately two years and 11 months and were you working on august 25th? 2020. I was, and were you working with an officer pep moretti on that date? Yes, head youve been working in the previous days during the civil unrest that was occurring in kenosha, yes, and on august 25th. What was your assignment, your general assignment, uh with your partner officer moretti, so on that date and time we were um assigned to second shift patrol, we were patrolling the downtown area as well as handling calls that popped up throughout the city.

Anything in progress, so is it fair to say you were focused downtown, but if there was a reason or another part of the city for a domestic violence or a burglary, you would still respond to that. Call. Yes, is that different than how the lets say the night before was in your duties? I believe that, throughout most of the time that was kind of the same, we were heading to in progress calls focusing on the downtown area to handle any incidents that arise now. On august, the night of august 25th, at any point, were you ever asked to respond to a potential shooting? I do recall um going to a shooting. We were just right in the area im, not 100 sure if we were dispatched to that call or not so, but at some point you and officer meredi went in the direction of some shots. Yes, and do you recall how you went about going to that location? Yes, so we were in the area of 60th street and about 12 between the 12 and 1300 block. On a other call, i believe it was a fire. I heard the gunshots coming to southeast of us. I looked at officer moretti and we decided at that point. We were going to head to that since it seemed in progress now in your training. What are you trained to do if there is lets say an active potential, active shooter situation? Our number one focus is to stop the killing or to make the scene secure, eliminate any active threats.

So with that in mind, what, if anything, did you do when we approached the scene um, we had approached slowly just to try to attempt to gain any visual information that we could see. We had just been with a few other squads, other armored vehicles in the area, so we were assuming theyre behind us and we approached the scene very slowly to determine if we could at least get a visual on the um. Any threats that we could uh see. We were hearing gunshots, we just couldnt, see where theyre coming from at that point. Did anyone approach your vehicle? Yes, who approached your vehicle? There was a younger male. He was dressed in a t, shirt and i believe, cargo shorts and he was carrying an ar 15 style assault rifle and he had his hands raised and you believe he was carrying a medic bag as well. Did you hear anything of the crowd was shouting in relation to this individual? I did not hear any specific phrases. There was just a lot of noise, a lot of background noise and, in my mind i was more focused on hearing the gunshots and trying to figure out where they were coming from. I didnt necessarily hear any specific words. The crowd was shouting toward me. Do you at one point im gon na represent you theres, a video. It shows you getting out of the squad car and running to the trunk. Do you have any idea why you did that a lot of my equipment i use on duty is stored in the trunk.

Um gas masks fast things like that. If i would have retrieved something from the trunk, it would have been to keep me safe on the scene if there was an active shooter. I do not recall. I do not recall the exact item by vest. Do you mean like a bulletproof vest? Yes, were you already wearing a bulletproof vest? I do not recall what vest i was wearing, but i do had. I had my steel plate carrier with me. The vest im currently wearing right now is not able to prevent a rifle round going through, but the steel plate carrier that i had at that time would have been able to stop anything up to a round coming from our rifle, so the vest youre wearing now Is that sort of the standard everyday vest that you would wear yes and a bullet fired from an ar 15 like the one the defendant had your vest would not stop it at all its not rated for it. Ive never attempted to do it, but i do not believe it would, and how about your squad car is your squad, car armored in any way that would prevent rifle rounds from penetrating it to my knowledge now. So what do you do as this uh person is approaching you for on the street? As i watched an approach, i was giving them verbal commands to keep away from my squad. I did not want anybody coming up to directly to my squad.

That could be a potential threat, so i was, we were giving him verbal commands just to stay back. I had also grabbed my pepper spray out of my vest and was going to use it if the individual continued to approach the car. Why did you see him as a threat? I never met him before he had a rifle given the fact. The situation at hand theres a lot of circumstances where i just did not want some individual coming up to my squad car in that scene, with his gunshots. Still going off that i didnt necessarily know uh, you said you said his hands were up correct, i believe so. Yes did you feel like he was surrendering to you. No, why not? Throughout the past few days, weve come across a lot of individuals who are armed, and the first thing they do is put their hands up to signal that they dont mean any threat to us. Doesnt mean that theyre surrendering it just means that they just wanted us to see their hands. Um hands are the most. I mean they typically indicate if the threat is going to be present. So if we can see their hands, we we generally know theres no threat. There so you indicated that you grabbed your your oc, sprayer pepper spray. What happened next, the individual approaching our car was not responding to my verbal commands um, so i checked the osc can made it make sure it was able to discharge the spray – and i pointed it at the individual and i just charged a streamable seed spray towards Direction when he, when he would not listen to my commands at that point, how close was he to your and youre in the passenger side? Yes, at that point, how close was he to your passenger side door? I believe he was within about five feet.

Do you know if the spray hit him or not? I do not recall, did the spray have the desired effect of him getting away from the vehicle? Yes, he ended up walking away from me, so once you once, he left the air of your vehicle. What happened? Next, i began to see other squad cars and our vehicles coming to the area. I believe i took up a position on the east side of the road towards parking lot and just kind of held it there to attempt to gain eyes as more officers came on scene. Throughout that time, i just tried securing the scene as best as possible, trying to gather as much information as possible about where the shots were coming from, who was firing them and who the suspect was what, if anything happened. Next, we were approached by one of the mutual aid, tactical teams who informed us that they had an individual with a gunshot wound to the arm. I believe that individual was mr girl squids, and they did not know how to access the hospital. Since i was familiar with the area austin reddy and i got into our squad car and we escorted that tactical vehicle to the east side of the uh freighter south hospital and got mr girl squids into the er. Now the tech, the tactical veal you mentioned – is that what some people commonly refer to as like a bearcat or an mrap, or something like that? Yes, so then you accompanied that to the hospital uh and it contained mr gross crates who had been injured.

Yes, now uh at the hospital uh. What happened? What did you observe? So we got him in the hospital. I believe he went back to the er. I stayed in the lobby. I was approached by another individual, richard mcginnis, who kind of talked to me about that. He gave me information that he believed that he had the suspect on video just prior to the shooting. So i talked to him briefly obtained the cell phone and obtained the uh individuals id card and then did you have him be interviewed by someone at the in your department. Yes, i passed all that information along to the detective bureau. I believe sergeant duet now at the hospital, when you were there with officer moretti, did you have any interaction with joseph rosenbaum who at that point had deceased? I believe that i helped officer moretti process and collect the evidence from one of the deceased. I do not recall which victim it was no further questions. Thank you. So i dont have a whole lot of questions for you but um. So if i could and weve heard uh office, room ready testify. Okay, so um, do you hear um what you believe to be rifle rounds around 11, 50 or so on the 20? I should on the 25th i heard gunshot rounds. I could not tell if they were handgun or rifle rounds, okay, so the the type of firearm that had been discharged at that point it was difficult for you to make up yes, and but you knew that thered been a discharge of firearms.

You heard that much! Yes, so do you recall seeing um a person that you now know to be mr rittenhouse walking toward your toward your squad? Car? Yes, okay and um, to be fair, he has his hands like this right. Yes, okay, and i understand that you said that uh tell me if im right throughout that evening, uh people – maybe who had firearms when they saw you they put their hands up, so you knew that they werent a threat to you. Yes, this is also to be fair, um, a way that someone could surrender. Yes, it could okay and again dont. Take this as being critical im not trying to be that way, but as hes walking toward you, he doesnt have at that point his hands on his gun, but hes just walking toward your vehicle. Right. Yes – and i understand your concern but as hes getting closer to you, um after knowing that a shot or shots had just been fired, i know theres a lot going on, but were you interested in finding out if he had any information? I was okay and when he starts coming to the side, hes coming to your side right, yes, do you hear him like say anything to you? The only thing i can remember him saying was something about a shooting that there was no other verbal indication from him. Coming directly saying it was me, it was just something about a shooting, okay and you had just heard shots fired.

Yes, this persons walking to you with his hands up and says something about a shooting right. I mean his exact words were not something about a shooting, but he says something included in that. Something is the word shooting yes, and so i understand that you weve seen the video you pull out your oc spray and after giving him a command you you spray him with the spray right. Yes, do you see mr mcginnis? You had mentioned that you see mr mcginnis at the hospital um. He shows you the video. Yes, do you say to yourself thats the thats, the guy thats walking with his hands up that i just saw. I did recognize the individual from the video and i into my mind. I believed he looked familiar. Okay and again so you do you tell anybody at that point like look, i im putting these together, the guy that has hands up thats. The guy were probably looking for. Yes, okay, oh, i do have two other questions as hes walking up to you. Um. Do you ever ask him and i understand its a chaotic situation? Do you ever ask him for identification? No, do you ever uh ask him or do anything with the fact that hes possessing an ar 15? No! No. I have no other questions. Thank you, sir. Were there other people not necessarily in front of your vehicle, but around the area? In addition to mr rittenhouse, i do not recall were other people trying to give you information regarding a shooting or a potential shooter, or anything like that.

There was a lot of voices shouting. Nobody directly came up to my squad. Car window, like mr red house, did, but there was people after he after he had left the side of my squad car, as i got out of the squad, who did give me information about potential suspects as well. Now, when you and officer murray are trying to get down to this scene of the active shooter um, what is your primary goal? Stop the killing, stop any threat. Is that consistent with getting identification and speaking to an individual approaching your vehicle? No, thank you closer um. You may step down this day, calls kristen harris to the stamp. Do you see the testimony about to give this matter be the truth, the whole truth and lets put the truth to help you god. Yes, let me be seated good afternoon, sir, how you doing, could you state your name and spell your first and last name for the record yeah? My name is chris don harris k, r, i s t a n last name harris h, a r r. I s, how are you currently employed um, basically ive been furloughed, but ive been pursuing my passions obviously doing the rundown live, which is a reporter and i do talk radio. Can you tell us what the rundown live is uh its an independent news of media? We try to bring all viewpoints, have civil conversations, sometimes about difficult content or content, as well as we cover protests of all varieties of all political viewpoints as well.

Is there a large group of people that uh produce the rundown live or are you kind of the main person theres theres, several people that are involved there, its a group of citizen journalists, we we quite often um, post stuff from other independent news sites? Do we try to report news before the mainstream media does so we can give a very raw version? What is your educational background um? You know i finished high school, but uh education really didnt become important to me till my later years. So you know most of my research ive done through my own reading of books and information. Do you have any formal, journalistic training that i do not and uh? Do you operate on the milwaukee area? That is correct. How long have you been involved with the rundown live uh ive been doing reporting for about 12 years when you say reporting is that all the rundown live or other stuff uh. I also contributed to one of the top police accountability websites, as writer known as cop block, which has been around for a long time. What is that called cop block cop block? Yes, dot org website um and when you say you contribute to them, does that mean youre like a reporter for them? I used to write for them, though its a defunct organization under that was banned amongst a lot of other websites. Okay yeah. When did you first get involved in the rundown, live uh, its probably around 2011? Did you form it or did someone else, someone else formed it, and then you joined it.

Yes, that is correct and that person is no longer involved. Do you have any sort of title with that organization? I would, i guess i believe, im the editor um and you said youve covered a lot of protests. Can you tell us more about that sure? Since about 2013, i probably covered over 150 protests. I dont know the exact number: what types of protests would they be um, everything from uh? Something basic is second amendment rights and health care workers. You know against mandates to blm uh minneapolis uh, the burning down of the third precinct um dc, obviously january 6, as well as kenosha, and probably countless blm protests. There were some things there that i just want to make sure. I understand what youre saying you said: the burning of the third burning down mr precinct of minneapolis. Yes, oh that was the day i dont know the date thats how i recognize it. That was one of the things that happened after george floyd was killed. That is correct and you sorry karen do. We need to slow down sure she, whatever she says, so we got ta we got ta, make sure uh you also mentioned january 6th. Is that, with regard to what happened at the united states capital on january 6th of this year, that is correct? Were you there for that? I was okay and were you covering that for the rundown live that is correct. You mentioned kenosha. Were you here in kenosha for the events that followed the shooting of jacob blake? I was on scene within an hour or two of the shooting of jacob lee.

Were you then well help the jury to understand when you talk about um, the rundown live were familiar with a lot of different types of media newspapers – magazines, the internet, things like that. Can you help us understand exactly what you mean when you say you cover these things, yeah im a citizen journalist, so i generally go to these events and i stream a lot of the times. I interview people to try to get natural conversations and have civil conversations. So people can understand in my viewpoint what people really are saying before there might be some propaganda added, so essentially its the most raw form of journalism. So when you came down within an hour or thereabouts after jacob blake, were you interviewing and speaking to people? Yes, do you record that in any way, yes, i do well, i stream it its recorded on the cloud. Okay. So is it fair to say that when you are covering any sort of event for the rundown live, you have a camera that is taking video of the things you see uh? That is correct. I type i usually use my cell phone, which is a high end device and then that video is live streamed to the internet on whatever site you use, so that people can watch it pretty much live. Is that fair to say that is fair to say? Okay, so, for example, on the night jacob blake was shot on that sunday night august 23rd.

You were here using your equipment to live stream. The things that you were seeing that is correct. Did you continue to do that on monday night, yes and again on tuesday night? Yes, so i want to skip right to the night of tuesday august 25th. 2020. um, you were were you here in kenosha that night i was. Were you live streaming for the rundown live as well as collecting, b roll, correct, im, sorry b. Roll is footage that you take because you cant stream live because your internet connection is so its actually recorded straight to the device. Okay, do you recall approximately what time you would have arrived in kenosha that that particular day or night, uh yeah around eight oclock, 8? 15.? Where did you go once you came to town? I headed down to the courthouse because thats, where things were happening and then did you start your live streaming at that point i attempted to but courthouse internet isnt, the greatest weve all learned that lesson so uh. What did you do then? I recorded videos straight to my cellular device, because this way at least i had documentation, i could publish later. Did there come a time in which your internet connection approve improved? Yes, how did you manage to make that happen? Um, it started to improve uh when i first started to head towards 59th in sheridan. Okay, do you know what changed that made that better? Yes, i ran into an interaction between ryan balsh, i believe and gage gross cruz and other people, that by the courthouse – and i asked if there was more armed individuals, because the night before there was a video that went viral of people protecting property, and i felt It would make a different story than getting the same story.

I had the last two days and i i do want to talk about what you just mentioned, but i think i didnt ask my question very well. You talked about being here and having poor internet by the courthouse, but then it got better when you went down to addition, so i could stream live. What was it that made the internet better or stronger down there than here? Do you do you know? I dont know if it was just: i had poor cell phone service or it was just better location thats. The only thing i can think of is that that location on my way there it improved, i attempted to go, live again and i was able to so. Is it fair to say that once you were able to go live you continued to broadcast live throughout most of the rest of the evening? That is correct. Until my battery ran out, okay and uh did there come a time in which you went to that 59th street car source location? Yes, okay and youve been here in the courtroom throughout parts of this trial? Is that fair to say that is correct and you have seen other witnesses testify, such as mr bulge and mr lakowsky? Yes, that is correct. Okay and when you were out live streaming that night, you uh went to that car source location and interacted with those individuals on some level. Is that fair to say that is fair? Okay, i want to focus in on a period of time in that evening, when there was a dumpster that was pulled out in the road outs out in front of the 59th street car source.

Do you rem, im, going to ask two separate questions? First of all, do you independently remember that happening? Did you also get some video of that? I did? It was streamed, live okay and then from there did you continue to remain physically at the 59th street car source location for several minutes. After that, i did and were you in close proximity to either ryan balch or the defendant, or both of them during those several minutes afterwards, probably within 20 feet. Okay, could we begin im going to wear tvs around if not ill turn them on? Could we watch a little bit of your live stream, which has been marked as exhibit number 18, and were going to go to the one hour 22 minute and 14 second mark um? Let me just ask mr harris: do you recognize what is up on that screen? I do, can you tell us what that is uh? It looks like a dumpster that is in the middle street, and is this a portion of your rundown live live stream from the night of august 25th. 2020.. It is, and would you agree with me that we are looking uh well? Did you personally recorded this correct correct, and this is taken from the 59th street car source lot looking into sheridan road facing east? Would you agree with that at this frame? Yes, okay, can we please play the video and uh militia are up there? We need water yeah, we got a fire where oh dumpster fire dumpster fire hey its just like the year man yeah.

If 2020 is a blunt, it would be just a stem. It would just yeah, it would just be stand and see man i could use a doobie right now continue the video for just one. Second, please, mr harris. There are two people in this video that im going to point out to you theres a gentleman here. That is a little bit taller gentleman with a beard, some sort of cap on and theres a woman. Next to him that appears to have sort of reddish hair. Do you see those two people? I do im gon na ask two questions. First of all, that night, do you did you have any idea who those people were? I did not, as you sit here today, do you know who those people are um? I believe one of them was the person who shot the fire behind or the gunshot behind. Uh rosenbaum and i dont know where the other one is because her back is turned to me. No dispute thats, joshua and kelly zaminski, okay, so ill represent to you, sir, that uh the gentleman the taller gentleman is joshua zaminski and the woman next to him is kelly. Zaminski. Okay, please continue all right. Dont cause problems when theres, nothing here, yeah thats! True, just stay on your property, just otherwise youre caught theres way too many of them. There is an individual who is standing on the edge of that frame on the right hand, side there.

Do you recognize that person as gage gross courts? I do okay, please continue protect your property. I have to agree with her yeah. They shouldnt be on the street theyre just protecting their property, one guy, one other guys an. I know i thought they were yelling at them. I was like wow yeah. If you guys could switch him out just somebodys a loose cannon, he hes got a lot of rage. He says the wrong thing. This whole crowd burns you guys alive. If you guys could switch him out just somebodys a loose cannon. He hes got a lot again. I want the jury to see that in the middle of the screen there there is a taller gentleman with his hands in his pockets that is joshua, zaminski and uh on this on the tv screen to the left of him. Uh with jeans on that is kelly. Ziminski all right, please go ahead rage. He says the wrong thing. This whole crowd burns. You guys alive, protect your property theyre, respecting that just keep it there. Applause hes just trying to protect his property. He doesnt want anything hes. Not! He has no problem with you. Guys he just doesnt want to want to burn down his. I cant blame him. I understand: hey your job isnt to be in the street. You got ta stay on your property thats. Why you got problems already with people? No one bothering your property, dont, dont! Dont! Look for trouble a medic, i know you are but like they got their own medics, you know somebodys close by take care of them.

I know youre just trying to make peace as this video is playing. We hear your voice speaking to someone um in the background. Do you hear that yeah, who are you speaking to i believe that was an interaction with kyle reynolds? Do you recall anything about what he was saying to you at that point that he was a medic, and that was it pretty much that i got from that? You said at one point: they have their own medics. Did you hear that? Yes, what did you mean by that um? I cover a lot of protests, so i become familiar with a lot of the blm organizations over the summer, especially during the george floyd marches. So i felt a little bit more comfortable per se, because i have had more interactions thats, all. Basically, i was sure, but you indicated they have their own medics. What does that mean? Uh? Basically, the medics are from my understanding. Are individuals who volunteer to help out and take care of individuals that were injured and ive seen them on multiple occasions? Eight individuals that were injured in protests continue, but they dont look at it. That way, they look at you guys as its its a different its as much as you guys were afraid of them before they marched down. Here i know but like with a conversation, so you made a comment there about how they dont look at you that way or something along those lines.

What did you mean by that? A lot of the protesters identified, the armed citizens as counter protesters they didnt identify them as just protecting their property, would be fair to say that it was your impression that thats, my impression sure would it be fair to say that it was your impression that the People in the crowd viewed the people around mr rittenhouse as a threat um. I wouldnt say that i would say that there may have been some individuals that had died, but not in the majority. I cant speak for everyone. I dont know what they were thinking. Okay, no lets continue. Please thanks guys. It appears that mr balch and mr lukowski are running towards you yelling gas, gas gas. Would you agree with me on that? That is correct. What was going on uh, the bearcats were rolling down the road and they began to tear gas and trying to push the crowd past. I believe thats uh towards 60th, south sixties.